Matthew is very smart (he is a student at Harvard), and very humble. That combination has swayed Christians from the Truth for centuries, and Matthew is very convincing in his bold case for gay marriage. If you choose to listen to his case, I would urge you to also read the response to Matthew from another Matthew, 23-year-old Matt Moore. Matt experienced the homosexual lifestyle for most of his life until the grace and love of Jesus Christ transformed him. I’d love to have him come share his incredible testimony on our program, as several others have done. Here is Matt’s response to the Matthew Vines viral video, plus a link to Matt’s page.
God Condones Homosexuality? (Response to Matthew Vines)
Unlike many of the people that disagree with you, I can actually empathize with you. I am just as attracted to the same sex as you are, and like you I did not choose those attractions. I am your age, almost 23, and for the past two years I have also been on a search for truth. My search differs from yours, though. You see, I was already unashamedly accepting of my homosexual feelings and was out to everyone that I knew by the age of 20. Then, in Sept of 2010, God interrupted my life and caused me to take a more massive U-Turn than I could have ever imagined. Over the past two years I have come to know God, study His Word, and understand homosexuality in a way that I never had before.
Firstly, I am not even going to debate you concerning Sodom and Gomorrah or the two passages in Leviticus that clearly point out homosexual behavior is an abomination. If I hear one more thing like “well do you eat shellfish or watch football? that’s a sin!”, I will spontaneously com-bust. We are at this time under the New Covenant, by the blood of Jesus, and the ultimate source of clarity and truth about how we are to live will come from the New Testament Scriptures. I am not by any means voiding out the importance, truth or relevance of the Levitical Law; but because of the confusion it may cause some of the readers I will refrain from it for the time being and focus on the three NT Scriptures that you also addressed.
” For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who by their unrighteousness suppress the truth. For what can be known about God is plain to them, because God has shown it to them. 20 For his invisible attributes, namely, his eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly perceived, ever since the creation of the world, in the things that have been made. So they are without excuse. For although they knew God, they did not honor him as God or give thanks to him, but they became futile in their thinking, and their foolish hearts were darkened. Claiming to be wise, they became fools, and exchanged the glory of the immortal God for images resembling mortal man and birds and animals and creeping things.
Therefore God gave them up in the lusts of their hearts to impurity, to the dishonoring of their bodies among themselves, because they exchanged the truth about God for a lie and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator, who is blessed forever! Amen.
For this reason God gave them up to dishonorable passions. For their women exchanged natural relations for those that are contrary to nature; and the men likewise gave up natural relations with women and were consumed with passion for one another, men committing shameless acts with men and receiving in themselves the due penalty for their error.
And since they did not see fit to acknowledge God, God gave them up to a debased mind to do what ought not to be done. They were filled with all manner of unrighteousness, evil, covetousness, malice. They are full of envy, murder, strife, deceit, maliciousness. They are gossips, slanderers, haters of God, insolent, haughty, boastful, inventors of evil, disobedient to parents, foolish, faithless, heartless, ruthless. 32 Though they know God’s righteous decree that those who practice such things deserve to die, they not only do them but give approval to those who practice them.
- Romans 1:18-32
In your argument, you firmly state that you believe this passage, but say that the rest of us have remained unaware of the true contextual meaning. You claim that the homosexuals this passage is referring to are people who always had heterosexual feelings, but in defiance to God they turned away from him and adopted homosexual behaviors, which are contrary to their nature. You tell us that this passage isn’t applicable to people who were born homosexual, because same-sex desires are natural to them.
Basically, you say that if your born gay, same-sex relationships are okay. But if your born straight, it’s not okay. In fact, you claim that if a person who thinks they are gay gets married and has a family with someone of the opposite sex, then they are in sin and deep idolatry since they are doing what is contrary to their “true nature”. You believe, according to this Scripture, that God has made some of us gay and some of us straight, and that we should live according to how he oriented us.
I am sorry, but you have to have a deeply darkened heart to be able to believe such a foolish lie and extract such an erroneous interpretation from this passage in Romans.
Everything that you have stated above about “innate same sex attraction” being the justifiable reason to pursue relationship with a member the same sex can not be found in Romans nor any other book, chapter, line, or verse in the Bible. You are taking your own ideas and projecting them into the Scripture rather than taking the Scripture and allowing it to shape what you believe. If you want to believe homosexuality is not unnatural, by all means I guess you have the right to do so. But in no way, shape or form can you use Romans 1 to back that position up.
In the first few chapter of Romans, Paul is making a point to group us all into the classification of sinners. He points out that we have all been given a knowledge of God… yet we have all suppressed it and rejected Him. He states that because of our stubborn rejection God has given us over into the grip of our sins… with some it is homosexual passions and desires…but ultimately we all fall into the list of over twenty sins as the end of Chapter 1. That is the point of Romans 1… pointing out all of us as sinners… not just some of us.
1 Corinthians 6 & 1 Timothy 1
“Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,”- 1 Corinthians 6:9
“For whoremongers, for them that defile themselves with mankind, for menstealers, for liars, for perjured persons, and if there be any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine;”- 1 Timothy 1:10.
The references to homosexuality in the above verses come from the Greek words [malaokois] (effeminate)and [arsenokoitai] (abusers of themselves with mankind).
Arsenokoitai is a term that Paul seems to have coined, in which he used two words to form the one. The word is made up of the two terms “bed” and “male” in the plural sense, hence we see he means two men in a bed. You say that this carries more of an economic context, such as prostitution, rather than same-sex sexual sin. You claim that 1 Corinthians 6 isn’t even directed toward sexual sin contextually. The problem is that you are once again adding in your own ideas into the text and also just plain wrong. The context of this part of 1 Corinthians is in fact sexual sin, as we see Paul rebuking the church in regard to the man who had sexual relations with his mother in Chapter 5… immediately proceeding from Chapter 5 carrying over his theme of sexual immorality into Chapter 6.
Again, Arsenokoitai: Two men, one bed… pretty clear.
Now, malaokois is another term you also addressed and informed the viewers of your video that it’s definition in the greek was “soft”, which is true. Many who agree with you say that we can’t really know what Paul meant by using this word and harshly forbid that anyone draw any lines from this word, “soft”, to homosexuality. I have one problem with this…. it’s right after the word describing homosexual behavior in the midst of two entire chapters addressing sexual immorality. Therefore I would say it is relevant to the issue of sexual sin and is in fact defining the “passive” partner in homosexual relations or even describing those who are homosexual who act like women… which we still see much of that behavior today.
But on that note, pertaining to effeminacy, I will say one thing… there are many ignorant and arrogant Christians who look at someone like me and say that I am effeminate because I don’t wear camouflage, watch football, and shoot stuff while I sit in a tree. That’s…. retarded. I’m sorry, I can’t think of a better word to describe the redneck-idiocy of that ideology. Biblical masculinity is defined as being the leader, authoritative, protective, the cultivator, the provider, etc. That is biblical masculinity. So the church, and our culture, needs to stop coming down on guys who are into arts, music, theatre, etc. Stop telling these people they need to change or that they are “Fags”. There is nothing masculine about feeding a little deer all year long then going and getting up in a tree and shooting it. If you want to be masculine, jump out of that tree and tear you clothes off and chase that deer down and kill it with your bare hands! …… that’s extreme. Sorry. But you catch my drift…
(And all credit to Matt Chandler for that vivid imagery used to mock cultural masculinity, love that guy)
And while I’m at it I’ll go off on another tangent. It’s time the gay community stops drawing upon the sympathy of its hearers with ideas of oppression and hatred and being singled out among people groups. That is NOT true. I have lived an openly gay lifestyle.. in the south… IN THE BIBLE BELT… and I was accepted by all and condoned by most. The gay community is not persecuted or oppressed in the slightest in our western society; not in any way how they make it out to be. I do not deny that in rare, individual cases that hatred is shown… but as a whole… the gay community is more accepted by society than the Christian community. And each day our society is moving toward more of a “toleration” mindset… which I am not saying is a bad thing. I am glad gay people are not beaten and ridiculed as they used to be, because nobody should endure that. But let’s define “toleration”. The gay community has to stop accusing Christian’s of “hate speech” and intolerance because we share with them what the Bible says about homosexuality and the redemption found in Jesus Christ. Most Christians (obviously excluding westboro baptist) are not exercising demeaning hatred toward homosexuals, they are just exercising their right to share what they believe is the truth. The truth that would and could save their soul.
Okay let me reign this back in to the main point. Matthew, and all others who are advertising and believing this “gay-gospel”: Your extreme perversions of the Scripture are going to be the death of you. Please, ask the Lord to soften your heart and let you come to the Scripture ready to hear him rather than coming to the Scripture, deriving parts from it, and adding in your own ideas to make it flow with your acceptance of homosexuality.
If you are a professing Christian who accepts your homosexuality and believes the outrageous interpretations that people like Matthew Vine’s are presenting, please check your heart. Examine yourself and see if you truly love Jesus. Not the “Jesus” you’ve created with your imagination who condones everything you do and just wants you to have your “best life now”. I mean the Jesus of the Scriptures, who fulfilled the Scriptures, who was crucified for the sins of His people and raised for their justification. It is only in this Jesus that salvation is found.
- The Cross in the Closet: A Review
- Andy Stanley confounds the Church about homosexuality (standupforthetruth.com)
- Andy Stanley’s “Microcosm of the Church” (donotbesurprised.com)
- Kennedy honors judges ousted over gay marriage (foxnews.com)
- What is sexual orientation? (carm.org)
- Gay Christianity Refuted: James White’s Full Response to Matthew Vines (christianresearchnetwork.org)
- The Matthew Vines video ~ and a response (standupforthetruth.com)
- Gay Marriage: Seperating the Sheep From the Goats (standupforthetruth.com)